It’s one thing to support gay marriage. It’s quite another for a professed Christian to bear false witness about Christ to make the point. That is why Joe Carter doesn’t mince words in an open letter to President Obama. Carter writes:
Implying that Jesus supports same-sex marriage—and there really is no other way to interpret your statement—is nothing short of blasphemous.
No, Mr. President, Jesus does not support same-sex marriage. Even a liberal Christian like you should not be able to make such an historically and theologically absurd claim with a straight face. The history of Christian thought on sexual ethics from the time of the stoning of Stephen to the Stonewall riots has been consistent that engaging in homosexual behavior is strictly and clearly prohibited by God’s Word…
To imply that Jesus would support same-sex marriage is contemptible. I realize it probably won’t hurt you come election time—too many Christians are more concerned about saving your seat in the Oval Office than they are with slander against our Savior—but I encourage you to repent of your blasphemy.
Read the rest here.
Something seems to be wrong with the link to Joe Carter’s post. I can’t access anything on touchstonemag.com. A big Forbidden message comes up.
Tim and Andy (another Andy here). Seems to be a nationwide or systemic problem. I can’t access Joe Carter’s post either, and I can’t access John Piper’s post about the subject either. I get the same error message you both get.
Yet it’s listed in Google. Touchstone’s root is also down. Hacked?
Can’t access it either….
Obviously, Big Brother does not want any true, intelligent, God-inspired Christian responses to freely circulate in cyberspace. We have so many of our free-speech rights threatened or taken from us already. Sadly, a worldwide platform has been given to any who want to teach heresy and blaspheme the Word of God. I am reminded of an incident from Corrie ten Boone’s life. As told in her book, she and her father watched as German soldiers loaded persecuted Jews into a vehicle to transport the Jews to the death camps. Her father, with a greatly burdened heart, said, “those poor people.” Corrie asked if he was referring to the Jews. He responded, “No, the Germans, for they have touched the Apple of God’s eye.” God gave us the Bible to point us to Christ and show us His will and His way. He will not reward with kindness and mercy those who pervert His word as a means to a wicked end, I believe.
yeah, i can’t access the original links either…. i wonder whats going on…
Do you think murder should be legal? What about theft? How about fraud?
All of those things are wrong according to scripture. Therefore, to make them illegal is to legislate according to scripture. So, it’s not that you mind morality being legislated, you just mind it when it’s morality you don’t agree with.
While I’m personally opposed to gay marriage, it is a fallacy to say that the something is wrong in Scripture and therefore we legislate against it. If we apply that logic to abortion, then abortion must be Biblically ethical – and we know it’s not. So be careful.
Furthermore, murder, theft, and fraud are all actions of force upon another person, and THAT is why they are illegal. Homosexuality is not a force (sin) against man, but a sin against God. If we are going to legislate against homosexuality for being sinful, then we must also legislate against divorce and extramarital sex for being sinful. But we do not. The church doesn’t even recognize these sins as being equal to the sin of homosexuality – which they are.
Creating laws that infringe on the rights of the people to choose for themselves (no matter how ethically abhorrent we find it, so long as force is not being exerted upon another) only sets ourselves up for being legislated against in the future, when 51% of the people get tired of Christians using the government to strong arm the people.
I find Obama’s application of the “golden rule” to gay marriage to be blasphemous, but that doesn’t mean that I also approve the NC’s choice to amend their Constitution (although I do believe that at the state level, they have the authority to do so, albeit unwise). As Christians we need to realize that God’s moral law will not be followed by those who do not love Him. Christ Himself said this. Do we not believe it to be true? Laws are not intended to curb behavior but to criminalize it. The NC amendment will not keep homosexuals from their choice and it will not keep them from “marrying.” On the contrary, it will only encourage them in their sin. Paul, in the book of Romans speaks to this; that our sin nature is inclined even more to sin when given the law.
It’s time that Christians STOP this witch hunt. This isn’t what the Gospel of Christ is about. Christ died to save sinners – Christ died to save homosexuals from their sin. We can be firm in our position that homosexuality is a sin, but we cannot continue to pias and belligerent when it comes to dealing with the topic. Once a topic is no longer taboo, it cannot be made taboo once again. It’s time to turn and face it. And creating laws like this only hurt the cause of the Gospel, it does not help.
The only solution to this marriage issue is to abolish the marriage license. The marriage license is not even a Christian marriage, so we should not be upholding it as our sacred cow.
There is a difference between legislating against something and celebrating and endorsing it. Laws allowing for gay marriage are normalizing and celebrating a sinful behavior. It is saying that this sin is actually not a sin, but a societal good. It is something to be protected and honored. So that is a far cry from legislating morality.
In regards to Paul in Romans, your reasoning would imply that God giving us the Law was a bad thing, because it only made us sin all the more. But take Paul’s thoughts to their conclusion, which was that seeing his sinfulness because of the Law showed him his need for Christ. The Law is a tutor to show us we need a Savior.
Romans 7:13 – Therefore did that which is good become a cause of death for me? May it never be! Rather it was sin, in order that it might be shown to be sin by effecting my death through that which is good, so that through the commandment sin would become utterly sinful.
@Johnny – yes there is a difference between legislating something and embracing it. That is precisely my point. The legality of gay marriage in a relationship that doesn’t even resemble a Christian marriage is of no force on my Christian marriage. The marriage license is a contract between you, your wife and the state. A contract is an agreement whereby the terms for breaking that agreement are established forthright. This is not a Christian marriage. A Christian marriage is a covenant, established and defined by God, between Himself, you and your wife. A covenant is consecrated by blood (the first sexual union does this) and is a life long commitment where only death is intended to end it. A covenant enforces that the commitment is to last through all aspects of life and that it cannot be left for predetermined things. So why Christians think the marriage license is something that belongs to the church is beyond unreasonable. Pagan cultures have been marrying in their own definitions since the Fall of Man, it should be no surprise that they are doing it yet again.
With regards to the reference from Romans, I am not saying that the Law is a bad thing. On the contrary, the law shows the sinner, inclined by the Holy Spirit, to recognize their sin and their need for a savior. But for those who are not inclined by the Spirit, the law arouses the sinful passions of the flesh: Romans 7:5 “For while we were living in the flesh, our sinful passions, aroused by the law, were at work in our members to bear fruit for death.” We have a modern example for this. When prohibition was enacted it increased the consumption of alcohol, crimes associated with consuming alcohol, and rebellion towards abstaining or drinking in moderation. We abolished prohibition, not because drunkenness was suddenly ethical, but because we confounded the problem and made it worse.
Only the Holy Spirit can convict us of our sin through the law. But without the grace of the Holy Spirit, our sinful nature is aroused by the law. The Law is a good thing; our sinful nature is not. And that is my point.
How long will we be surprised that the United States in not the Kingdom of God?
We often note the ways we disagree with the government, but do we really understand marriage from God’s point of view?
Christian Leadership can become pro-active within Christian circles by teaching about Christian marriage without expecting the secular government to ‘get it right’.
Does anyone really believe the secular nation is ‘teachable’ regarding marriage?
If this short post raises your curiosity, then you can check out my post, “As Citizens; vote. As Christians; Clean Your Own House!
Matt, Matt,Matt…just read your post. Glad your read read Dr. Burk’s blog even just as an opposing view. Think about that. You don’t know him, yet you know what’s in his heart. However, you said we don’t sharks in our President’d heart. Why is that, do you suppose? The leader of the greatest free country in the world…to whom we have entrusted “our lives, our fortunes, and our sacred honor”….why do we not know where he really stands on every issue of life and government? And, I find it so bewildering to hear liberals quickly berate conservatives with the politically incorrect word “JUDGING” every time conservatives try to tell where they stand and why. According to your statement, the government should protect my desire to build on land that is reserved for habitats of endangered species because I believe human needs are more important than those of the spotted owl, regardless of the fact that the govt doesn’ believe as I do. Just an example from the other perspective.
Matt, Matt,Matt…just read your post. Glad your read read Dr. Burk’s blog even just as an opposing view. Think about that. You don’t know him, yet you know what’s in his heart. However, you said we don’t know what’s in our President’d heart. Why is that, do you suppose? The leader of the greatest free country in the world…to whom we have entrusted “our lives, our fortunes, and our sacred honor”….why do we not know where he really stands on every issue of life and government? And, I find it so bewildering to hear liberals quickly berate conservatives with the politically incorrect word “JUDGING” every time conservatives try to tell where they stand and why. According to your statement, the government should protect my desire to build on land that is reserved for habitats of endangered species because I believe human needs are more important than those of the spotted owl, regardless of the fact that the govt doesn’ believe as I do. Just an example from the other perspective.
“Homosexuality is not a force (sin) against man,” Wrong
“but a sin against God.” True
Can you show me where I’m wrong? Simply making a statement is not productive.
John T. "Jack" Jeffery
Thanks for posting Joe’s comment here Denny. If you hadn’t we would not have access to it, regardless of why the Touchstone site is down. And, you are right. Joe does not mince words on this issue. The time for that, if there ever was one, is long past.
Thanks Denny for all your articles!
I wrote a summary blog article linking to Denny’s articles on the President and gay marriage and Andy Stanley’s controversial sermon illustration, and other examples of “culture rot”.
It also links to Dr. James White’s excellent responses to pro-homosexual activists, Dan Savage and Matthew Vines.
I just do not believe that God cares if two men or two women engage in sexual behavior with each other. When you think about it, it is just sex. Lot of heterosexuals have sex in or not in marriage with no intention at all of having children; some cannot have children. God surely doesn’t care that they have sex with each other anyway. I really don’t think God is some kind of entity that is constantly worrying and whining about how people in love behave with each other. He is not, I trust, a Petty God. Why don’t ya’ll worry about your own intimate relationships and let other folks worry about theirs.
John T. "Jack" Jeffery
Touchstone Magazine’s site is back up. The following was posted by James M. Kushiner on Thursday, 10 MAY 2012 to Touchstone’s “Mere Comments” blog page.
Yes, Our Server Crashed
Thursday, May 10, 2012, 11:36 PM
James M. Kushiner
My apologies to our readers–our server for http://www.touchstonemag.com has been done [sic] most of today. We’ve addressed the issue and things should be back to normal now. Thanks for your patience.
Source: Touchstone Magazine at http://touchstonemag.com/merecomments/2012/05/yes-our-server-crashed/ [accessed 12 MAY 2012].
As a result, readers may now access Joe Carter’s blog post:
The Blasphemy of Barack Obama
Wednesday, May 9, 2012, 11:00 PM
Source: the “Mere Comments” blog on Touchstone Magazine at
http://touchstonemag.com/merecomments/2012/05/the-blasphemy-of-barack-obama/ [accessed 12 MAY 2012].
I respect the opinions of others as well as I respect the President’s opinion that same sex couples should be able to marry. But when the President implied that the Bible supports same sex marriage, he crossed the line. Having an opinion is one thing; lying on God is another. The Bible is clear about how God feels about homosexuality as well as all other sins. We have become a nation that calls good evil and evil good. The Bible tells us that in the last days, this world will become like Sodom and Ghomorrah, and when same sex couples are allowed to be legally married in six states in America, I see a Sodom and Ghomorrah nation developing. What used to be considered an abomination 20 or more years ago has today become the acceptable norm. God does not change and neither should we. It’s a sad day in history when our nation’s leader would imply that God would support something as abominable as same sex marriage. If God desired for us to marry the same sex, he would have created Adam and Steve and not Adam and Eve. All throughout the Bible, we can see how God feels about homosexuality. For us to try to pretend that same sex marriage is ok in the eyes of God makes us out to be deceived liars. I support what God supports and I hate what he hates. Point Blank!
I have read the bible through and through. After finishing my current book, Ulysses by James Joyce, I plan to read it again (the King James version). It is a great though difficult read. It shows an incredibly primitive religion (God telling his soldiers to kill every man, woman and child after defeating God’s enemies), especially in the old testament. Thank goodness He did in fact change over the passage of time (we can’t stone people for working or Sundays anymore–a big whew! from me on that one as I work at a library on Sundays!). Anyway, the new testament is still pretty much based on Egyptian myth (they had 2 trinities, rather than just one!) and Asian and Greek and Roman myths. The idea that God is constantly angry and twisted and upset and hostile towards humans is a pretty decent metaphor but to take it literally and to incorporate all of that anger into your own personality as a literal truth rather than as a metaphor really does lead to pretty horrible outcomes, including really bad jokes about Adam and Steve. The story of the Garden of Eden is a great one and provides wonderful lessons about the nature of man and the world, but taken literally it just distorts all of the excellent concepts about rebellion and truth and knowledge, etc. etc Anyway, I know I am in the minority in what I am saying here and I wish no ill to anyone who is trying to make his/her way through this troublesome world. We are all doing our best with whatever navigational tools we are using.