A Pitbull with Lipstick

I think Mayor Rudy Giuliani and Governor Sarah Palin delivered the two best speeches of the Republican National Convention. Up until this point, the Republican line-up has been pretty weak compared to the strong showing the Democrats made last week.

Palin gave a barn-burner. My favorite line from her speech was an off-the-cuff remark in response to delegates holding signs that said “Hockey Moms 4 McCain.” Palin, a former hockey mom herself, said this:

“I love those hockey moms. You know [what] they say the difference [is] between a hockey mom and a pit bull? . . . Lipstick.”

Classic.

106 Responses to A Pitbull with Lipstick

  1. Nathan September 4, 2008 at 7:48 am #

    It was a good speech for someone who has never been on this large of stage before. She appeared confident (for the most part) and connected very well with the television audience (at least with me). It remains to be seen how the fallout on her personal issues will play out, but she certainly didn’t flop.

    Giuliani pounded Obama and hit hard on many issues that the democrats are going to have to answer. I would expect republicans to pick up on these and continue the assault. Giuliani was definetly the best speech thus far.

  2. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 8:35 am #

    Nathan, I have to disagree a little bit. Palin stole the stage last night. Guiliani was the set up man, and Palin hit it out of the park. She didn’t just give a good speech for someone who has never been on this large of a stage before, she gave a GREAT speech that put the Republicans back on the map. She looked like a complete pro. No gaffs, no hiccups, and no nerves. She was unflappable.

    Her speech was quite possibly the most anticipated speech for a Republican ever, and she totally delivered. That was the story last night, not Guiliani.

  3. a preacher's wife September 4, 2008 at 8:49 am #

    I don’t think the hockey mom/pitbull comment was “off the cuff.” She’s said it before. In fact, I read it earlier this week in an online magazine article about her history. I think it’s probably a line she uses often. I still liked it. Still like her. But the quip wasn’t as spontaneous as you might be inclined to think.

  4. Nathan September 4, 2008 at 9:06 am #

    Steve,

    I don’t want to take anything away from Palin. She did an excellent job, but this speech will not rank with the greatestest speeches ever. It will from the standpoint that she is the first woman vice-presidential nominee in the Republican party.

    But to say it was the most anticpated Republican speech ever? What about Lincoln, Roosevelt, and Reagan? Very good speech though.

    To clarify my comment about Giuliani. He did an excellent setup job and Palin (give her credit) followed much of his theme in attacking Obama’s lack of fortitude and experience.

  5. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 9:14 am #

    I think the fact that she is the first Republican woman to run on a Presidential ticket definitely ranks her speech among the most anticipated ever. Absolutely. It doesn’t make it the best speech ever, but it certainly ranks among the most historic. Not sure how you can argue otherwise.

    By the way, Roosevelt was a Democrat.

  6. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 9:20 am #

    FDR was a Democrat. Teddy was a Republican. My bad.

  7. Darius September 4, 2008 at 9:20 am #

    “It makes you and other Democrats look like hypocrites. Aren’t you guys the supposed party who champions women? Now she’s a “b****”?”

    Steve, you hit on a bigger issue here. The liberal media has shown what they really think about middle class women, that they should be seen but not heard (much like blacks in the Democratic Party). If they tow the liberal line, great. But if they actually have minds of their own, the liberal mindset goes berserk.

  8. Don September 4, 2008 at 9:32 am #

    I thought all the main speakers make some very good points. Which candidate would you hire for an executive position?

    Someone who has been an executive or someone who has voted “present” a bunch of time?

    Someone who says they will not challenge the patriotism of a prisoner of war hero or the hero himself?

    Someone who can give a good speech or someone who can make the hard decisions?

  9. Lucas Knisely September 4, 2008 at 10:28 am #

    Palin = clincher

  10. Branden September 4, 2008 at 10:55 am #

    I bet many would rather Palin be at the top of the ticket.

  11. MIKE September 4, 2008 at 11:21 am #

    I thought her speech was wonderful! I’d be tempted to agree, she should be a the top of the ticket. Maybe this will be the Deborah of the United States, who knows? Rudy did a fantastic job too though he was a bit more caustic.

    Did anyone watch this on PBS? The woman they had on the floor was so obviously disgusted claiming they had just ‘belittled Barak,’ it’s amazing the people can count facts as belittlement, if anything they shrink swollen heads.

  12. Paul September 4, 2008 at 11:41 am #

    “Steve, you hit on a bigger issue here. The liberal media has shown what they really think about middle class women, that they should be seen but not heard (much like blacks in the Democratic Party). If they tow the liberal line, great. But if they actually have minds of their own, the liberal mindset goes berserk.”

    This is such jive, Darius, and you know it.

    Liberals are pro-woman, but there are plenty of reasons to be skeptical about a woman who…

    Is the John Kerry of reform: was for the bridge to nowhere before she was against it, asked Stevens for plenty of earmarks when she was mayor, then was against them as a governor. A maverick is only a maverick if they’re a maverick when it’s not politically expedient.

    Is not a responsible mom: I won’t say that she should be the stay at home mom, because if you’re in a position to be governor, you go be governor, girl. But to have a special needs kid, and not make your husband stay home while you’ve got a 168 hour per week job? That’s irresponsible parenting. And by the way, the abstinence only talk really worked well in her household, I must say.

    Tried to have books banned from a library: from a school? Personally, I’m not a fan, but I get it. But a library? That’s crossing the line, and I don’t want a politician in ANY office that thinks that censorship is a worthy stand to take.

    wants to fire people that don’t think exactly the way she does: said librarian who knew better than to ban books had her job on the line until her fellow townspeople spoke up.

    Can a woman run for office? Yeah!

    Should a woman run for office? Absolutely!

    Should that woman be a responsible person that cherishes the rights found in our constitution? Yeah.

    And THAT’S why I have problems with THIS woman.

    And by the way, for all of her “I’m just like you!” blather, here’s the absolute proof that the Republicans couldn’t give a hoot about the working man…

    At the DNC, all of the incidental music was obviously played by a band in the background(you could hear the occasional mistake, vocal tunes weren’t always in original keys, etc, etc, etc).

    At the RNC, not only was all of the incidental music from a tape, but then on top of that, all of the musicians that they had there all played to canned (taped) music!

    Is there anyone who is more of a working stiff than your average society band/wedding band types? Nope. And if the RNC couldn’t be bothered to find a band to play the hits of the Bachman Turner Overdrive in the Twin Cities, it’s absolute proof that they have absolutely no compassion for the true average American working stiff.

  13. Darius September 4, 2008 at 11:57 am #

    Wow.

    Abstinence education sometimes fail, because people aren’t perfect or always wise. But that doesn’t make it not worth teaching. We can tell people not to drink and drive, but they will still do it. Are you suggesting that we just tell them to wear a seat belt when they drink and drive?

  14. Paul September 4, 2008 at 12:07 pm #

    Darius,

    Miss the point some more why don’t you?

    Obviously, any Christian parent will want to stress that abstinence is key to a healthy relationship with your mate, with your family, and above all, with God.

    But to leave out the part about, darn it, if you’re not going to listen to your parents, be smart enough to keep yourself from getting pregnant, just proved itself to be absolutely irresponsible.

  15. Branden September 4, 2008 at 12:15 pm #

    But to leave out the part about, darn it, if you’re not going to listen to your parents, be smart enough to keep yourself from getting pregnant, just proved itself to be absolutely irresponsible.

    Is this a response from your Christian perspective?

  16. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 12:16 pm #

    Paul,

    Here’s what you just had the gall to say:

    “Is not a responsible mom: I won’t say that she should be the stay at home mom, because if you’re in a position to be governor, you go be governor, girl. But to have a special needs kid, and not make your husband stay home while you’ve got a 168 hour per week job? That’s irresponsible parenting. And by the way, the abstinence only talk really worked well in her household, I must say.”

    I have four kids and one on the way. My youngest son has Autism. My wife drives an hour to work each day, works an 8 hour day, and makes the hour drive back home. I work as well. Are you saying that my wife is a bad parent?

    Do you have a family? Have you spoken to her children or her husband? Do you have the foggiest idea of what you’re talking about? Do you have any clue as to what costs are associated with raising a special needs child? Do you, Paul, have any clue about these things?

    How can you suppose these things? Have you ever said the same thing about Barak and Michelle Obama? They are both on the campaign trail, after all, spending countless hours in meetings, giving speeches and jet-setting around the country. Do you think Mommy and Daddy tuck the Obama kids in each night? I don’t personally know their situation, but I would guess that they have to juggle the complex issues of family life just like every candidate does. What makes Sarah Palin the sole subject of your parenting advice?

    Also, no one claims that talking about abstinence guarantees that a child won’t become pregnant. No one guarantees that discipline in the home means that kids won’t make bad choices. The issue is not whether problems will arise, but how we deal with those problems. The issue is not whether or not talking about abstinence is the fool proof method to eradicating teen pregnancy. The issue is whether or not abstinence is the proper way to conduct oneself in regard to sexual matters.

    I talk to my kids all the time about cleaning up after themselves at the dinner table. When they leave a mess (which they regularly do), does it mean that I should stop holding them to a standard of cleanliness?

    Seriously, Paul, you should think about what you’ve written here. I know you are a thoughtful person, but you’ve really offended me here. My family, in many ways, mirrors the Palin family. You’ve basically told me that people like my wife and I are bad parents. I’m pretty disturbed that you would judge people like us so harshly.

  17. Jason September 4, 2008 at 12:21 pm #

    Paul,

    That was ridiculous.

    I don’t know what was worse: your total lack of compassion and humility for a parent whose child clearly made a mistake or your inane rambling about Dems being pro-“the people” because they hired a bad band to play live.

    Sigh.

  18. Paul September 4, 2008 at 12:33 pm #

    Jason,

    there’s no lack of compassion for the child. But the parent is old enough (and hopefully wise enough) to have known better!

    And, would you be talking about compassion if this were NOT the VP nominee for the Republicans? Probably not. Then it would have been yet another godless person who would have been better off if she’d just find Christ.

    Well, this one did know Christ, but didn’t know how to keep from getting pregnant, because her parents couldn’t be bothered to have a simple conversation with their child.

    This whole idea in American Christian circles that the best thing we can do about nearly everything is to just not talk about it is clearly Einstein’s definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting the results to be different.

    And, Jason, as for your calling my thoughts on the RNC/DNC band thing “inane rambling,” I must ask, where is YOUR compassion?

    To you, it’s just music. To me, it’s my livelihood. To you, it’s just a small thing, but to me, that’s seeing that in Denver, 7 or 8 guys ate and paid the rent that week, and in St. Paul, the Republicans couldn’t be bothered. Today, it’s not paying a few musicians to provide your incidental music. Who gets the axe next time?

  19. Darius September 4, 2008 at 12:37 pm #

    Good question, Jason. That last part about the band was bizarre.

    “But to leave out the part about, darn it, if you’re not going to listen to your parents, be smart enough to keep yourself from getting pregnant, just proved itself to be absolutely irresponsible.”

    Why is that irresponsible? I know that as a liberal, you hate promoting responsibility and accountability to people, but I do believe that is the wisest way. If you can’t keep your pants on, you should be willing to face the responsibility. Sex devoid of responsibility is debauchery. Furthermore, the promotion of birth control as a cure-all helps add to the idea that babies are a curse, which is extremely destructive for a society to foster.

  20. Darius September 4, 2008 at 12:42 pm #

    Your ramblings are disgusting, Paul. How do YOU know that she didn’t use “protection?” You are the wisest person in your own eyes, and it’s getting old. You condemn people for the motives that YOU place on them. A more self-righteous liberal I haven’t met. You have so many good days, then you go on these ridiculous rants which make me wonder.

    “To you, it’s just music. To me, it’s my livelihood. To you, it’s just a small thing, but to me, that’s seeing that in Denver, 7 or 8 guys ate and paid the rent that week, and in St. Paul, the Republicans couldn’t be bothered. Today, it’s not paying a few musicians to provide your incidental music. Who gets the axe next time?”

    Seriously?? How self-centered (or occupationally-centered) can someone get? Where in the world did you even find that information? That’s the definition of straining at a gnat…

  21. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 12:46 pm #

    Paul,

    Here’s an article about the surprising amount of live music in Saint Paul and Minneapolis during the week of the RNC. It appears that many people don’t want to play for the Republicans, but a bunch like to play outside the walls in protest.

    Either way, your point is a bit odd, but I guess I see it. All that business that the RNC brought to Minnesota in hotel, restaurant, and arena industries (to name a few) goes out the window if you don’t hire a wedding singer to do your music, huh? Seriously?

    http://www.startribune.com/entertainment/music/27605759.html?elr=KArksLckD8EQDUoaEyqyP4O:DW3ckUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aUUJ

  22. Branden September 4, 2008 at 12:52 pm #

    This is still a Christian blog, no?
    Well being that it is, I would hope that those who claim Christ are informed about contraceptives-abortifacients.

    Surely one is to consider such things and how they work if one is recommending them and trying to honor God on this subject.

  23. Jason September 4, 2008 at 12:53 pm #

    Paul said: “there’s no lack of compassion for the child. But the parent is old enough (and hopefully wise enough) to have known better!”

    To known what better??

    Paul said: “And, would you be talking about compassion if this were NOT the VP nominee for the Republicans? Probably not. Then it would have been yet another godless person who would have been better off if she’d just find Christ.”

    First, you’re assuming a lot about me.
    Second, yes, I would be talking about compassion. Is this realy the response of a Christian? “They should’ve known better” with the implication they are bad parents and poor Christians?? Come on.
    Third, if she wasn’t the VP nominee for the Republicans would you be attacking her so harshly?

    Paul said: “Well, this one did know Christ, but didn’t know how to keep from getting pregnant, because her parents couldn’t be bothered to have a simple conversation with their child.”

    First, are you going to be so harsh and judgmental that you do not recognize people make mistakes? I assume then that you have never sinned after coming to Christ. Congrats.
    Second, why do you assume her parents never talked to her about this issue?
    Third, why do you assume she had no idea what “safe sex” was as opposed to abstinence?
    Fourth, why do you assume she didn’t know how to keep from getting pregnant?
    Fifth, why do you view getting pregnant as the sin?
    Sixth, wouldn’t a consistent Christian worldview view the extramarital/premarital sex as the sin? How then would you propose to communicate to people not to sin? Condoms? (Since you are obviously using this as proof that abstinence programs are wrong…you might want to figure out what the sin is.)

    Paul said: “This whole idea in American Christian circles that the best thing we can do about nearly everything is to just not talk about it is clearly Einstein’s definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting the results to be different.”

    I have no idea what you are talking about on this one. But I gather that Christians are at fault for people having sex and getting pregnant.

    Paul said: “And, Jason, as for your calling my thoughts on the RNC/DNC band thing “inane rambling,” I must ask, where is YOUR compassion?”

    I consider my comments accurate….compassionately accurate. 🙂

    That point made no sense. You just wanted to hammer the Republicans for something…and it was simply ridiculous.

    I have compassion for you…but that doesn’t mean I have to tolerate dumb arguments.

    Your idea of compassion is the typical liberal idea….you must accept what I say and be nice about it…but I can attack anything you say or do. (Hint: look at your posts about Palin)

    Paul said: “To you, it’s just music. To me, it’s my livelihood. To you, it’s just a small thing, but to me, that’s seeing that in Denver, 7 or 8 guys ate and paid the rent that week, and in St. Paul, the Republicans couldn’t be bothered. Today, it’s not paying a few musicians to provide your incidental music. Who gets the axe next time?”

    Maybe all that says is that the Dems like bad live music and the Reps prefer CDs. Who knows?
    Do you REALLY believe this is proof the Dems have the people at heart? LOL
    That’s why Obama wants to raise every conceivable tax out there and then add some new ones. He really loves us!! So if he’s Pres, and you get that next gig…just go ahead and give over half to the government…because thats what’s coming if Obama is Pres.

    Can’t you feel the love??

  24. Darius September 4, 2008 at 1:00 pm #

    You know, I have an acquaintance who is probably going to vote for Obama PRIMARILY because he supports more federal money for the sciences (the guy is a physicist). Now it seems Paul supports the Democratic Party because they pay a handful of musicians to play music instead of just buying a CD to do the very same thing.

    Has everyone gone insane? What next, someone will vote for Obama because his skin tone is darker than McCain’s? Oh wait…

  25. Truth Unites.. and Divides September 4, 2008 at 1:16 pm #

    Jason and Darius, I appreciate you guys and your excellent comments.

    Keep up the good work.

  26. Paul September 4, 2008 at 1:17 pm #

    Since we’re going to jump off subject completely here (and I don’t deny that it’s my fault, btw…)

    “Now it seems Paul supports the Democratic Party because they pay a handful of musicians to play music instead of just buying a CD to do the very same thing.”

    Yep, just stop paying musicians to play everywhere because after all, you can just play CDs instead.

    I wouldn’t vote for a Democrat over a Republican just because of that, but it does prove something: The left, by and large, respect culture. They realize the importance of art, literature and music to society. So, that means that they support the NEA (national endowment for the arts), CPB/PBS/NPR and fund project to keep art and music programs in the schools. Republicans don’t see the point. They forget that art and literature and music inspire, they neglect the proven link between music theory and math (and therefore science as well). It explains their love of modern country music (music taken to its lowest common denominator), for simple speaking politicians and for Ann Coulter (put simply: you can tell the difference between a well read Buckley conservative and a Coulter conservative in less than a minute).

    So, it’s a small glimpse at a much bigger picture. But I will say this: the party that respects my livelihood will get my vote. And the Republicans could give a hoot about my livelihood. After all, they could just as easily buy a CD to do the same thing, right?

    That said, buy my CD.

  27. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 1:20 pm #

    Paul,

    Still haven’t heard if you have any clue about raising a special needs child in an environment where both parents work. I’m living it, brother, and I’d love to hear your answer. Any clue at all? Do you think I’m a bad parent?

  28. Quixote September 4, 2008 at 1:20 pm #

    Paul,

    Your CD sucks.

    So I won’t be buying it OR hiring you to play live.

    That doesn’t mean I’m a Republican. It means I have good taste in music.

  29. Quixote September 4, 2008 at 1:21 pm #

    Paul,

    Let me clarify:

    I’ve never listened to your CD or to you play in concert. So how praytell can I judge OR comment on your music? I can’t. At least not honestly.

    And so it is with your assinine comments about Palin’s daughter…and how and why she got pregnant. You don’t know.

    Please don’t judge or comment about what you don’t know.

  30. Jason September 4, 2008 at 1:27 pm #

    So, first it was: “Dems care for the working man, Reps hate them.”
    How do we know? The Dems had live music (I might add “supposedly” to this, since we don’t know for sure who did or did not have live music) and the Reps did not (again, we’re assuming here).

    Now, it is: “Dems care for the arts, Reps hate the arts.”

    I have never seen more absurd statements than these (except for maybe the comments about Palin’s daughter).

    Sadly, this is about as good an argument for voting for Obama that I have seen.
    It at least rivals the people that are voting for him because he’s a) half-black, b) gives a good speech and…..oh, wait, I think that’s it for the reasons to vote for him…I guess we can now add “doesn’t hate the arts like Reps do”.

  31. Truth Unites.. and Divides September 4, 2008 at 1:31 pm #

    Quixote in #25 and #26:

    ROTFLOL!!!

    That was brilliant repartee.

  32. Paul September 4, 2008 at 1:39 pm #

    Quixote,

    I would say touche, but your comments are, as nearly always, lame.

    As for nobody knowing HOW she got pregnant, you prove my point: even right wing Christians need a sex ed class.

  33. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 1:41 pm #

    Paul,

    Do you have any experience with having kids and parenting? How about parenting a Special Needs child while both parents are working? Any clue at all? I’m living it, brother, and I’d love to hear what your experiences are as the responsible parent of a Special Needs child.

    You’re obviously a musician, which of course makes you an expert on all things parenting. Come on, man, I need to know if you think my wife and I are bad parents.

  34. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 1:44 pm #

    Oh, and TUAD, either contribute to the conversation or stay on the sidelines. Your cheerleading is rather annoying.

  35. Paul September 4, 2008 at 1:45 pm #

    Steve,

    I am a parent.

    I haven’t a clue on how to raise a special needs child. I have enough problems raising one that’s crawling.

  36. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 1:48 pm #

    Then respectfully shut your mouth about whether or not people who have this burden and work for a living are responsible parents. Your grandstanding on this issue is painful to me as a Special Needs Dad.

    Unless you’d like to continue to lecture us on how irresponsible we SN parents are if we choose to work and take care of our kids. I’m all ears.

  37. Darius September 4, 2008 at 1:49 pm #

    {in the vein of Paul’s wild accusations}

    How do we even know if Bristol is the biological daughter of Sarah Palin’s husband? I heard rumors that she’s the milkman’s offspring.

    I was also told via an email forwarded to me from a friend who got it from someone in Nevada who in turn received it from some other person in Idaho (probably a next-door neighbor to Sarah when she was a baby). That person received the email from some lady in Alaska who used to be best friends with Mrs. Palin, has no ulterior motives, and is above reproach. The email told me that Mrs. Palin killed two kids for “getting in [her] way” while walking to the library to burn some books. The email also said that Palin secretly worships at a charismatic Jewish synagogue. She also attends classes at the local KKK meeting hall on how to properly appeal to white trash Americans.

    There is one other rumor which I am reluctant to mention, but since I hate Christian conservatives, why not? Supposedly, when Palin was running for that beauty pageant, she slept with every judge to make sure she won. And just as an extra precaution, she poisoned the prettiest girl in the competition.

  38. Darius September 4, 2008 at 1:51 pm #

    TUAD, I have to agree with Steve Hayes. Your team-building and cheerleading exercises are cheesy and unnecessary. I admire your willingness to stand up for truth, but lower the rhetoric a bit.

  39. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 1:52 pm #

    Darius,

    I see what you’re saying, but let’s be honest. Republicans are just as guilty of spreading wild rumors as Democrats. It’s sad that the political game is played this way, but both sides have a dog in the fight. There’s plenty of mud to sling, and Republicans don’t have clean hands either.

  40. Jason September 4, 2008 at 1:53 pm #

    That beauty pageant issue is compounded by the fact that (according to Paul) she is completely ignorant of methods of birth control and also unable to communicate about sex to anyone.

  41. Jason September 4, 2008 at 1:54 pm #

    Steve,

    Sadly true.

    Both sides need to tone down the rhetoric and mudslinging and lying. I am not optimistic that will happen.

    That’s why I am not a huge fan of either party (despite Paul’s assumption that I am some sort of die-hard Republican).

  42. Darius September 4, 2008 at 1:55 pm #

    TUAD, it’s one thing to commend someone on a particularly useful or insightful comment, but sometimes you border on trollish behavior. I know how easy it is to get into the “team mentality” where it’s us vs. them (I have been guilty of this on other blogs, and perhaps even on this one), but let’s strive to avoid such mindsets.

  43. Darius September 4, 2008 at 1:59 pm #

    OH, definitely Steve (though the Left is significantly more guilty of gossip and lies). The whole “Obama is a Muslim” is a stupid rumor which is completely beside the point. If he were truly a practicing Muslim, it MIGHT have some bearing on his campaign (I, for one, would want to know how he views the radical Islamic agenda of spreading sharia to the whole world in light of his religious beliefs). But there is no evidence that he is Muslim, and it’s been annoying to see people pass around emails to that effect.

  44. Paul September 4, 2008 at 2:00 pm #

    Now, to finally get this back on track:

    Jason in #21:

    (a warning real quick — if you thought my posts were long before, watch out…)

    You raise some very valid points. And a couple that have made sit back and think.

    Allow me to respond to the most important ones…

    1) Which is the sin, the pregnancy or the pre-marital sex?

    I don’t bring this up because it’s such a brain buster, because that’s an easy question. I bring this up because of the way I’ve attacked it, or at least the way that it’s perceived that I attacked it.

    Here’s the deal, and I might very well be wrong here. I see parenting as a three pronged thing…

    a) raise your child to be the best they can be: raise them to be strong in their faith, raise them to know that they can do whatever they set out to do, and give them the tools to do so.

    b) guide your child in the right direction: pass on your wisdom, whatever it may be, to ensure that they can live a life that is as rich as possible.

    c) protect them from their own stupidity: kids don’t know stuff, so you need to teach them when you can, and minimize the impact of their mistakes when you can’t.

    It’s that third prong that I believe that the Palins might have very well missed.

    Now, as to quixote’s pathetic attempt to show me up, here’s what we do know:

    Gov. Palin is all for abstinence only education. One can assume that she would be all for that in the home as well. It might not be a strong argument, but that argument CAN be made. And if that is the case, then I have to say, I think that that is absolutely the wrong way to teach sex ed, ESPECIALLY in the home. And, if that is the case, then there’s a pretty good chance that I was right.

    2) You questioned why I brought up Einstein’s definition of insanity in this case. Simple: this is far from the first time that this has happened. Yet, nothing ever changes. Too many Christians still would rather stay quiest on the subject than have the conversation that might protect their children from their own ignorance.

    And back around to Steve: I haven’t said squat about the Palins’ special needs child because I don’t know squat about what it takes to be a special needs parent. But I have had sex. Just trying to stick to what I know. But thanks for the shot.

  45. Paul September 4, 2008 at 2:05 pm #

    Steve in #33:

    Tone down the mock indignation.

  46. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 2:10 pm #

    Nothing Mock about it. You handled yourself like a jerk and I called you out on it. My blood is boiling over your pomposity on this issue. You, by your own admission, have no clue what the Palin’s or families like mine are facing. With that FACT in mind, shut your mouth about it. I don’t do “mock.” That’s your job.

  47. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 2:16 pm #

    Paul,

    You said Palin was an irresponsible parent because she and her husband work while they have a Special Needs child. How in the world does that qualify as “not saying squat about what it takes to be a special needs parent?” Please read your own posts before you lecture me about whay you said.

  48. Paul September 4, 2008 at 2:19 pm #

    Steve,

    Can it and your boiling blood. You think you have so much in common with these people. You don’t. Your wife is not the governor of a state. You don’t have the privelege that comes along with a job like that. To make it seem like I’m attacking you because I’m taking swipes at a POLITICAL CANDIDATE is…is…is…

    exactly what the Republicans are hoping you’ll do.

    Nice work.

  49. Paul September 4, 2008 at 2:21 pm #

    And considering her six figure job, no, her husband probably doesn’t have to work at the same time, dude.

    So, yeah, enough already.

  50. Jason September 4, 2008 at 2:24 pm #

    Paul,

    I think we should try to avoid assumptions. Almost all your comments are based on assumptions.

    You have no idea what the Palin’s taught their children. It is unfair to make conclusions based on what you think (or maybe even want) to be true.

    Moreover, it is a little simplistic (but very much in the liberal Dem mindset) to say: if we teach them ‘safe sex’ then they’ll not get pregnant.
    Kids with all the information and then some still make mistakes and sin and defy what they know to be right and reject information given them and rebel and 100 other things.
    To think that abstinence education causes more pregnancies than the ‘safe sex’ seminars is absurd. It’s obviously a long time since you’ve been in high school or talked to a high schooler.

    There are kids that have been given all the education that Dems deem necessary, and still get pregnant. Now whose fault is that? the kids. Just like when parents teach abstinence and that education is not heeded.

    But again…the whole argument is tainted because all we ever talk about is pregnancy, as if that is a great moral evil. We can thank the liberals and their hatred of children making the issue pregnancy. In the church, as believers, the sin is the extramarital sex.
    Now again I ask you…as a Christian teaching his children, what is the sin you want them to avoid?? If it is the premarital sex….what education helps them best abstinence or condoms?

    Now if you think that the Palins didn’t do the best job of teaching their daughter to abstain, fine. Maybe they did and she rebelled. Who knows? The point is that it is not abstinence education that is the problem…it’s sinful hearts and minds.

  51. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 2:26 pm #

    Paul,

    You made a scurrilous judgement about a woman and her husband who work long hours and have a special needs child. You shouldn’t have made that judgement. If she were a Democrat, you wouldn’t have made that judgement. You did, however, make that judgement, and you’re too prideful to admit that your judgement was painful and irresponsible to those of us who work long hours and have special needs kids.

    How you can make the music leap and not seem to get this one is beyond me. You’re sensitive about music because you’re a musician. How much more sensitive do you think I am with my own child!

    Your only defense, or argument, or whatever is to tell me to “can it?” That’s pretty thin, Paul.

  52. Jason September 4, 2008 at 2:33 pm #

    Honest question.

    Paul, are you married? Do you have children?

    I am not asking because the answer makes me exclude your comments. I am just curious because it does shed light on your comments.

    BTW, yes, the Reps want the people to identify with Palin. She is quite different than the other 3 men in the race.
    But the Dems want you to identify with aspects of their candidates, mainly the idea of change. But who are we kidding, Obama isn’t going to change anything to help the people. He’ll tax us more. How is that a positive change? He is a politician. Actually, he is just a talking head…he’s never really done anything. But Dems want you to believe is record is one of change….sad thing is his record is quite thin….but you bought it anyway…and so have millions of Americans who are too ignorant to see past the facade and the cheesy speeches.

  53. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 2:37 pm #

    Jason,

    4 things have already been established about Paul:

    1. He has had sex.

    2. He has a child who is apparently crawling.

    3. He is a musician.

    4. Rather than accepting responsibility for some judgements he shouldn’t have made, he’d rather tell us all to “Can it.”

    Did I miss anything?

  54. Truth Unites.. and Divides September 4, 2008 at 2:40 pm #

    I affirm and encourage those who contend with and against those of a distinctly liberal persuasion, whether theologically liberal or politically liberal.

    I’ve been in the arena contending for a long time, and now I greatly appreciate other biblical Christians who have also stepped up to contend vigorously against theological and/or political liberals.

    Pax.

  55. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 2:48 pm #

    TUAD – You drain my life force.

    Paul – I know you’re not a bad guy. Many times I like it that you’re a fly in the ointment over here. I usually don’t tow the company line so strongly, but I really was offended by your judgement of the Palin family and your determination that they are irresponsible. I think you need to re-think that stance, and I hope you will.

    Sorry if I got too personal with it. Like I said, I’m sensitive about it. You don’t seem to be at all, and that’s bothersome. You should think about that as well.

    Anyway, good luck with the band. i love Jazz. If I’m ever in the area, I’m going to come see a show. We’ll talk politics over a certain amber colored beverage.

  56. Branden September 4, 2008 at 2:53 pm #

    Paul,
    You condemn yourself with your own words. Your obfuscation in regards to what Steve has taken you to task is revealing. You have no standing to criticize those that have children with special needs.

    The proper response on your part would be to apologize and admit your wrong doing. In that you may regain some honor and nobility.

    The closet thing to being right is to admit your wrong and atone for it.

  57. Branden September 4, 2008 at 2:54 pm #

    closest not closet

  58. Cate September 4, 2008 at 2:55 pm #

    In an attempt to change the discussion:

    I am intriuged to hear your response to the classification of Obama as simply a community organizer. As neither an Obama nor a McCain supporter, I was a little taken aback at the tone used by Guliani and Palin. Although I think that experience should be a major discussion, I don’t know when being a community organizer became an insult, especially in light of what Obama did as a community organizer.

    As I watched Fox News after Palin’s speech, Laura Ingram commented that one of Obama’s campaign managers who is also a friend emailed her about the snide remarks regarding Obama. Ingram heartily disagreed with the assessment; however, I must admit that it turned me off quite a bit. As much as I like Palin and that I want to like McCain, I was a little disgusted with the negative tone.

    Just seeing what you all thought…

    http://dallasmorningviewsblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2008/09/why-do-republic.html

  59. Darius September 4, 2008 at 2:57 pm #

    “TUAD – You drain my life force.”

    I have to admit, that made me laugh.

    Paul, just stop and assess your arguments and words without thought of partisan politics. I’ve honestly never seen you more defiant while being caught in a utterly indefensible position. You had been quite jovial the last few weeks, but today…

  60. Branden September 4, 2008 at 2:59 pm #

    And Paul,
    I think it would be wise to consider what you are teaching a child when you teach them
    c) protect them from their own stupidity: kids don’t know stuff, so you need to teach them when you can, and minimize the impact of their mistakes when you can’t.

    In this context you seem to be referring to contraception.

    Again, I would look into abortifacients.
    Perhaps the aborting of a child through contraception is not a personal choice that you would wish for your child to make.

  61. Darius September 4, 2008 at 3:05 pm #

    Cate, I think the comments regarding “community organizer” are in response to the comments from Obama’s own campaign about how being a mayor, governor of a “small” state, and mother of 5 children qualifies as no experience. Giuliani and Palin RIGHTLY pointed out that Obama has no significant experience to speak of… as he himself said, one of his qualifications for being president is that he majored in international relations. He actually said that. He’s done next to nothing, and has the gall to pick on the VP candidate for actually doing something with her life beyond passing off cute little bromides like they were her own (read: the speech he plagiarized).

  62. Jason September 4, 2008 at 3:11 pm #

    Cate,

    I believe that Obama himself has used the phrase “community organizer” as his title when he worked in the southside of Chicago out of college. In fact I’m pretty sure this is the term in his bios.

    The term is not derogatory in any way at all.

    But, the snide comments come from the fact that basically his only experience before his unimpressive 4 years in senate (most of which he’s been campaigning for Pres) is as a community organizer.
    This snideness comes from when Palin was announced and the Obama camp criticized her experience (quite ironic) and basically said she’s only been a small town mayor. The fact is being mayor is actual experience compared with being a “community organizer”.

    I think her comments were quite fair.

    I hope that helps clear things up.

  63. Jason September 4, 2008 at 3:14 pm #

    Darius…you beat me to it.

  64. Paul September 4, 2008 at 3:40 pm #

    Jason in #49:

    Yes and yes.

    Jason in #47:

    I am not at all saying that safe sex education is some sort of panacea to all of our problems. And I agree that, of course, pre-marital sex is the issue at hand here. But, whether the case was rebellion or ignorance, the problem still stands that what happened at the end of the day was a child got pregnant when that did not need to be the case. There is definitely blame to be placed on the child, but not nearly enough people look squarely at the parents and say, “hey, where were you?”

    And if you think you can make a case for saying that liberals “HATE” children, I can make just as good of a case for saying that conservatives “HATE” poor people, so let’s not go there.

    As for this, which is a VERY legitimate question, and I’m glad you asked it…

    “Now again I ask you…as a Christian teaching his children, what is the sin you want them to avoid?? If it is the premarital sex….what education helps them best abstinence or condoms”

    I say both. I say focus on the abstinence. I say make sure that kids know about the emotional turmoil that they’re going to go through if they have sex before marriage, not to speak of the risks of pregnancy (which is traumatic enough for a couple that’s ready and wants kids…how much moreso for teenager that hasn’t even graduated high school yet?). I say make sure that kids know that sex before marriage, beyond being a sin, is germ warfare. But, if that kid is in a situation where they absolutely must, no matter what I say about the subject, must have sex, I would rather that they be protected from their own stupidity than pay for the consequences of that stupidity.

    But that’s me. And according to TUAD, I’m a virus, and according to Denny, I need rubber sheets.

    Like I said, I’m willing to be wrong here. But someone’s gonna have to make a way stronger argument than what I’ve seen here to convince me. We live in way too fallen of a world to trust that just because God’s way is the right way that anyone else will agree.

    Steve in too many posts to count: I apologize for offending. I cannot imagine what you go through on a daily basis, nor will I pretend to try.

  65. Truth Unites.. and Divides September 4, 2008 at 3:56 pm #

    I’m cheerleading for Sarah Palin.

    🙂

  66. Paul September 4, 2008 at 4:07 pm #

    TUAD,

    I’m an annoying, terrible, no good, very bad liberal who says scurrilous things, doesn’t want anyone to have any sense of responsibility, and thinks that the most awesome thing ever would be to give my paycheck directly to the IRS. I’m a virus, I tell you, and I’ve made my bed look like a very busy lemonade stand. On top of that, I’m a drone for the democratic party and I want to surrender to the first Iraqi I see.

    But you’re a troll.

  67. Darius September 4, 2008 at 4:09 pm #

    “I’m an annoying, terrible, no good, very bad liberal who says scurrilous things, doesn’t want anyone to have any sense of responsibility, and thinks that the most awesome thing ever would be to give my paycheck directly to the IRS. I’m a virus, I tell you, and I’ve made my bed look like a very busy lemonade stand. On top of that, I’m a drone for the democratic party and I want to surrender to the first Iraqi I see.

    But you’re a troll.”

    Truer words…

  68. Paul September 4, 2008 at 4:11 pm #

    you could have just quoted the last part, man…

  69. Darius September 4, 2008 at 4:17 pm #

    Not really. 🙂

  70. Paul September 4, 2008 at 4:21 pm #

    fair enough.

  71. Steve Hayes September 4, 2008 at 4:46 pm #

    Paul,

    Thanks for the apology. I appreciate it.

    Sorry for making it personal. I know you weren’t attacking me, but at the time it was hitting a pretty raw nerve. Funny how a freaking blog can generate such feelings. Glad we’re on good internet terms (insert digital hug).

    Your last post was a classic (the one about TUAD’s troll-ness).

  72. Truth Unites.. and Divides September 4, 2008 at 4:59 pm #

    “I’m an annoying, terrible, no good, very bad liberal who says scurrilous things, doesn’t want anyone to have any sense of responsibility, and thinks that the most awesome thing ever would be to give my paycheck directly to the IRS. I’m a virus, I tell you, and I’ve made my bed look like a very busy lemonade stand. On top of that, I’m a drone for the democratic party and I want to surrender to the first Iraqi I see.”

    Honest epiphany?

  73. Paul September 4, 2008 at 5:09 pm #

    No, TUAD.

    I simply call it proof that however bad I might be to some of the folks around here, YOU’RE WORSE.

    Please, either have an original thought, or go away.

  74. Lydia September 4, 2008 at 5:27 pm #

    Rudy was excellent. His points NEEDED to be made. Seriously, Obama is an empty suit and as of yet, the masses have not heard this about him. Rudy was right to point out his lack of experience, lack of even voting on issues and making decisions on votes put before him! Obama worship needed to stop.

    Obama worked for ACORN of which I am a bit familiar. It is very political and he was right there inside the Chicago pol machine which is one of the best in the country for organizing and helping dead people to vote and one of the best for doling out federal dollars. I know it has been said he helped with job training, etc. but you have to know what this means in big cities with Federal money. It is a jobs program for the people who work off these grants!

    Obama now has to prove himself. Rudy got it so right: Change is not a destination and hope is not a strategy.

    Everything was perfect. Rudy, the seasoned Exec going over both resumes and Palin, the populist, bringing it home.

    But my favorite part was her little daughter doing the full tongue to hand span lick to slick down baby Trig’s hair. Classic. Every mom watching could relate.

  75. Darius September 4, 2008 at 5:33 pm #

    Lydia, yes, that part where the daughter was slicking down his hair was so precious and cute. Every father watching could relate.

  76. Paul September 4, 2008 at 5:47 pm #

    I will admit, both Rudy’s and Huckabee’s speeches (Huckabee doesn’t get nearly enough credit for his oratory skills) were excellent.

    And Rudy was right: Change is not a destination and Hope is not a strategy.

    So, Lydia, where did you work on the South Side that you know so much about us? Which aldermen did you work with? Ever hang with Daley?

    We may have perverse ways of getting stuff done, but stuff always gets done in this town. Don’t talk about what you don’t know, and in this case, by your comments, it is very, very, very obvious that you don’t know.

  77. Truth Unites.. and Divides September 4, 2008 at 6:02 pm #

    Darius: Your ramblings are disgusting, Paul. How do YOU know that she didn’t use “protection?” You are the wisest person in your own eyes, and it’s getting old. You condemn people for the motives that YOU place on them. <b.A more self-righteous liberal I haven’t met.“

    Jason: “Now, it is: “Dems care for the arts, Reps hate the arts.”

    I have never seen more absurd statements than these(except for maybe the comments about Palin’s daughter).”

    Steve Hayes: You handled yourself like a jerk and I called you out on it. My blood is boiling over your pomposity on this issue. You, by your own admission, have no clue what the Palin’s or families like mine are facing. With that FACT in mind, shut your mouth about it. I don’t do “mock.” That’s your job.”

    Paul, YOU’RE WORSE.

  78. Paul September 4, 2008 at 6:06 pm #

    TUAD,

    even Darius (who you quote) agreed with me.

    even Steve (who you quote) both asked you to stop and claimed that you drained his life force.

    And, still, no original thoughts.

  79. Jeff Bailey September 4, 2008 at 6:27 pm #

    I thought she did a great job. Imagine the pressure she was under and you could never tell it by her poise and almost flawless performance.

    And did you see the mainstream media after the speach? They looked like their best friend had died.

  80. dongale September 4, 2008 at 6:27 pm #

    I haven’t read all of these comments, so maybe this has been said…but….

    I thought Giuliani’s speech contained just a little too much usual rhetoric that we’ve been hearing from Republicans over the last few years. I love McCain, but if he’s going to distance himself from Bush, this kind of stuff should be avoided.

  81. Jason September 4, 2008 at 7:00 pm #

    Lydia…dead on about Rudy.

    Paul…why do you assme s knows nothing about Chicago politics? How can you really tell she kows nohing from her statements??

  82. Truth Unites.. and Divides September 4, 2008 at 7:23 pm #

    I hope the trickle of Hilary supporters who are angry with Obama and have decided to vote for McCain will grow so large (as a result of Sarah Palin being on the ticket) that it will ultimately tilt the election over to McCain-Palin.

    That would be awesome!

  83. Darius September 4, 2008 at 7:27 pm #

    Paul, I didn’t agree that TUAD was worse than you, just that he exhibits trollish behavior.

    Jason, as you probably have already learned, Paul tends to jump to very hasty conclusions about other people’s experiences and motives.

  84. Paul September 5, 2008 at 12:43 am #

    Jason in #76 (and Darius, pot/kettle?)

    Lydia said…

    “Obama worked for ACORN of which I am a bit familiar. It is very political and he was right there inside the Chicago pol machine which is one of the best in the country for organizing and helping dead people to vote and one of the best for doling out federal dollars. I know it has been said he helped with job training, etc. but you have to know what this means in big cities with Federal money. It is a jobs program for the people who work off these grants!”

    1) ACORN does have a political component. However, to make it seem as if that is their first order of business is to not know how they work.

    2) The Chicago Political Machine itself doesn’t do the organizing. It’s the neighborhood block coordinators that do the organizing, usually with help from union guys, or community organizers when there’s a need (as there is throughout the south side)

    3) The dead people voting bit was the giveaway line. Congratulations, you’ve read a history book. However, her information is about as old as that history book, too. Daley Sr. was the last guy to pull that stunt. Daley Jr. has no need to. This is a town where the city Republican headquarters is in a half sized storefront in Lincoln Park.

    4) One of the best for doling out federal dollars. Again, a giveaway line. I can think of at least three instances in recent history where large chunks of federal funding dried up in Chicago, meaning that there’s no money to dole out in the first place.

    Need me to keep going, guys?

    Darius, just like you asked me somewhere else to ask before I tell, do the same. I might be wrong headed on some things, but about the town that I live in? Not so much.

  85. Lydia September 5, 2008 at 9:04 am #

    “1) ACORN does have a political component. However, to make it seem as if that is their first order of business is to not know how they work.”

    Uh huh. Ok, so it is NOT their FIRST order of business but the ‘outcome’ is strategized quite nicely.

    “2) The Chicago Political Machine itself doesn’t do the organizing. It’s the neighborhood block coordinators that do the organizing, usually with help from union guys, or community organizers when there’s a need (as there is throughout the south side)”

    That is ‘begging the question’. So excuse me…. The organizing is FOR the machine.

    “3) The dead people voting bit was the giveaway line. Congratulations, you’ve read a history book. However, her information is about as old as that history book, too. Daley Sr. was the last guy to pull that stunt. Daley Jr. has no need to. This is a town where the city Republican headquarters is in a half sized storefront in Lincoln Park.”

    It is an apt metaphor for how things work there and you know it. Walking around money, signing up illegals to vote democrat, etc. It is the same thing.

    “4) One of the best for doling out federal dollars. Again, a giveaway line. I can think of at least three instances in recent history where large chunks of federal funding dried up in Chicago, meaning that there’s no money to dole out in the first place.”

    We were talking about Obama’s early career. Besides, Are you serious? You really think Federal Grants for all sorts of programs has dried up? Seriously?

  86. Paul September 5, 2008 at 11:10 am #

    Lydia,

    You never answered my questions before. Which aldermen have you worked with?

    Still waiting. Because more than likely, you’re simply an outsider looking for a reason to talk trash about a system that you clearly don’t know.

    Is there corruption? Sure. Show me a town where there isn’t (and I’m living next door in DuPage county these days, where the Republican machine corruption is just as bad) and I’ll show you a town that REALLY isn’t getting anything done.

    And, Lydia, your last comment proves that you’re not serious. Of course there are still federal funds to be found, but I can think of at least five or six programs that got their federal funding cut in the last 10-15 years.

  87. Jason September 5, 2008 at 12:52 pm #

    BTW, Paul did you watch the RNC last night??

    Live musicians!!!!!

    I guess the Dems don’t have the market cornered on caring for people.

  88. Darius September 5, 2008 at 1:09 pm #

    Oh no, now Paul can no longer say that the RNC doesn’t care for people. If he does, he invalidates his argument in this thread.

    I wonder if the RNC was reading this thread and got all worried about losing the white liberal vote from Chicago so they found some live musicians.

  89. Paul September 5, 2008 at 1:10 pm #

    I was too busy playing. You know, stuff off the CD that quixote never heard but thinks is awful anyway (way to bare false witness there, btw).

    Glad to hear that someone at the RNC reads Denny’s blog and fixed their grievous error.

    Speaking of Republicans caring for people, one that made even this liberal laugh out loud and say, “how in the world is he gonna pay for THAT?”:

    I gotta say, his plan for subsidizing paychecks for outsourced workers is, well, umm, well, ummm, even more populist than Obama could ever hope to be.

    Shortly after that, I fell asleep, so I have no idea what else happened yet.

  90. Paul September 5, 2008 at 1:12 pm #

    Darius,

    you know how you complain when I get too snarky?

    speck/log.

  91. Lydia September 5, 2008 at 4:44 pm #

    “You never answered my questions before. Which aldermen have you worked with?

    Still waiting. Because more than likely, you’re simply an outsider looking for a reason to talk trash about a system that you clearly don’t know.

    Is there corruption? Sure. Show me a town where there isn’t (and I’m living next door in DuPage county these days, where the Republican machine corruption is just as bad) and I’ll show you a town that REALLY isn’t getting anything done.

    And, Lydia, your last comment proves that you’re not serious. Of course there are still federal funds to be found, but I can think of at least five or six programs that got their federal funding cut in the last 10-15 years.”

    Friend, Naming my Chicago connections is not going to make Obama more qualified for President.

    Perhaps things have changed in Chicago recently. I will take your word for it.

  92. Paul September 5, 2008 at 5:02 pm #

    Lydia,

    Do we agree that Obama isn’t the best candidate that the Democrats could have nominated?

    Sure!

    Are either of us going to vote for him?

    I’m assuming no.

    But talking trash about him because he knew how to grease palms and get stuff done is the work of rank amateurs. Those are the guys you WANT representing the people that just lost their jobs at steel mills and working at ACORN to make sure that poor folks have roofs over their heads, politically motivated or not.

    Could you make a case for saying that the South Side would have been better off had he stayed a community organizer or a State Senator? Yes, of course you could. I think he definitely made his jump too soon into the national arena (of course, running against Alan Keyes in Illinois, you couldn’t have asked for a more beautiful gift), and I would have liked to have seen him become a superstar in the senate and blossom into a mature politician.

    But, alas, at this point, we’re either looking at a situation where Obama gets elected and our country is doomed to half baked ideas, or McCain gets elected and our country is doomed to a completely different set of half baked ideas.

  93. Brian (Another) September 5, 2008 at 5:32 pm #

    Paul: You touched on something that occurred to me the other day. I think that many politicians follow the “half-baked” idea model that you mention. The thing that scares me is the inexperience of the hatcher (sic) of the half-baked ideas in the Obama candidacy. The combination does shout “change”, but not in a good way. But that’s just one man’s small opnion.

  94. Darius September 5, 2008 at 5:47 pm #

    Brian, as Rudy said in his speech, “change is not a destination.” There is such a thing as bad change and good change.

  95. Branden September 6, 2008 at 9:41 am #

    I would not follow Obama. He is not a man that I would allow to lead me.

    My definition of Man and Leader, he simply does not fit.

  96. Brittany September 7, 2008 at 10:25 pm #

    I oppose Palin’s politics and her candidacy, for many, varied, and heartfelt reasons, but never, ever because of her teenage daughter’s pregnancy. Sexist drivel.

  97. Lydia September 8, 2008 at 11:49 am #

    “But, alas, at this point, we’re either looking at a situation where Obama gets elected and our country is doomed to half baked ideas, or McCain gets elected and our country is doomed to a completely different set of half baked ideas.”

    This ‘earth’ is doomed no matter what. I quit putting my faith in ‘humans’ long ago yet I still vote. Civic duty and all. but, I am cognizant that I have pulled that lever for someone thinking they would do all to end abortion only to get Sandra Day O’Conner or Kennedy. And I have realized how silly we all are to put such hopes in mere humans.

    At this point, I trust McCain to deal with terrorism more than Obama. (And I trust McCain little)

    I think deep down NOBAMA (smile) has sympathy for the terrorists and I say this because I have listened to Wright’s sermons and heard Obama say he thinks he can ‘talk’ with the President of Iran! Scary stuff.

    Remember, Obama has only started sounding moderate since he decided to run. :o) It is campaign season and all leftists run as moderates and all moderates run as conservatives.

    With that said, Obama was a class act in responding to the Media about Palin’s pregnant daughter.

  98. Lydia September 8, 2008 at 11:50 am #

    “But talking trash about him because he knew how to grease palms and get stuff done is the work of rank amateurs.”

    I am definitely an amateur. :o)

  99. Kathy September 8, 2008 at 2:35 pm #

    ‘I think deep down NOBAMA (smile) has sympathy for the terrorists and I say this because I have listened to Wright’s sermons and heard Obama say he thinks he can ‘talk’ with the President of Iran! Scary stuff.’

    Jaw dropper! Oh yeah, peace man, peace, it’ll come if we are blind, terrorism will just simply disappear! I cannot take the mentality of some.

  100. Paul September 8, 2008 at 3:29 pm #

    “Jaw dropper! Oh yeah, peace man, peace, it’ll come if we are blind, terrorism will just simply disappear! I cannot take the mentality of some.”

    And I cannot take the overarching attempts at the cynicism of others (not that I’m not guilty of the same).

    Do you really think that anyone, Republican or Democrat WANTS another terrorist strike to happen against the US? The way that some of the idiots in this country talk, you’d think that’s the case.

    I’m no fan of Obama, but keep it to the facts, not what Limbaugh or Savage are telling you to think on AM radio.

  101. Kathy September 8, 2008 at 8:09 pm #

    Paul, there is nothing for me to respond to because your response to my comment makes no connections to what I said.

  102. Darius September 8, 2008 at 11:08 pm #

    Kathy, join the group. 🙂

    If Obamination wins the presidency, he will likely be relatively decent on the MILITARY side of the fight against radical Islam (as Paul said, he’s not an idiot), but will completely surrender to the ideological arena (which, I might add, wasn’t Bush’s strong point either). The REAL danger is not from terrorists (though that is important). The real danger is creeping sharia. In other words, the idea that Muslim law and social customs should overrun the whole world. While terrorism is supported by 10-25% of Muslims world-wide, widespread sharia is supported by closer to 75%. It has overtaken Europe to the point that blood will likely be shed in another Bosnia-like war, and it is also here in America. A father killed his daughters in Dallas to protect his honor. Mark Steyn and Macleans magazine were brought before the Canadian Human Rights Court by Muslims in Canada for printing an excerpt from Steyn’s book. Public universities have installed foot-washing rooms for Muslims only when they would never do the same for any other religion. Newspapers have been cowed into not printing the Danish cartoons. CAIR, a terrorism-supporting group, is given legitimacy by both the media and politicians when neither would ever give their equivalent, the KKK, the time of day. Terrorism is important in that it is one root of the same diseased tree (Islam as it is understood and practiced by the majority of Muslims) and because it enables the spread of radical Islamic culture, but the bigger issue is that spread.

  103. Paul September 9, 2008 at 12:40 pm #

    Wow! Darius and I agree on something!

    We’re both scared of Sharia making more gains throughout the world. Is it Canada that is testing out Sharia courts for family law cases involving muslims? Yikes.

    Kathy in #101, try thinking and connecting dots. Whether he wants to admit it or not, Darius got exactly what I was saying.

  104. Paul September 10, 2008 at 11:32 am #

    And?

    I’ve known about this for months, and I don’t agree with Meeks.

    People move to Oak Park, Naperville, Wheaton, or Evanston (where I believe New Trier is) because they want a world class education.

    And they pay for it. Property taxes on a decent house in Oak Park (we’re not talking the Frank Lloyd Wrights, mind you) top $10K in a few cases. My wife and I have joked that even if we won the lottery, we still couldn’t afford to live in Oak Park.

    The thing is, and Meeks knows this, is that if the kids that he bussed up to New Trier in this publicity stunt wanted a better education, they could get one.

    Chicago’s regular school district is more awful than not. But the magnet schools, military academies and charter schools are some of the best in the nation. You gotta make the grades to get into the magnet program, but if you want in, you can get in.

    The parents that don’t push their kids to get into the magnet program or scrimp and save to get them into the catholic school system (especially because you can claim private school tuition on your taxes these days, and the catholics are AMAZING about handing out scholarships here) are just sitting there with their hands out, and I have little sympathy for them.

    Does that warm your heart a lil, Darius?

  105. Darius September 10, 2008 at 11:51 am #

    It does. 🙂

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