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	<title>Comments on: Reckless Court Outlaws Homeschooling</title>
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		<title>By: PromiseJubilee</title>
		<link>http://www.dennyburk.com/reckless-court-outlaws-homeschooling/comment-page-2/#comment-40618</link>
		<dc:creator>PromiseJubilee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 05:28:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dennyburk.com/?p=1481#comment-40618</guid>
		<description>Okay, here&#039;s what I think about the whole submitting to the authority placed over you thing...
First, you are absolutely correct, the bible does say that (way to quote brother!), and I am sure that this law was for our own protection (as are many of God&#039;s laws)...
HowEVER, that does not, cannot, supersede all the other parts of God&#039;s law. We must follow the laws of the authorities placed over us, but only as far as it does not directly contradict the bible.
Proverbs 22:6 says, &quot;Train up a child in the way he should go; and when he is old, he will not depart from it.&quot; And should we allow OTHERS to train up OUR children in the way THEY think they should go? I pray that when I stand before the Lord on judgment day that I would not be so ashamed to say that I allowed someone ELSE to raise up my child. It is our duty.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Okay, here&#8217;s what I think about the whole submitting to the authority placed over you thing&#8230;<br />
First, you are absolutely correct, the bible does say that (way to quote brother!), and I am sure that this law was for our own protection (as are many of God&#8217;s laws)&#8230;<br />
HowEVER, that does not, cannot, supersede all the other parts of God&#8217;s law. We must follow the laws of the authorities placed over us, but only as far as it does not directly contradict the bible.<br />
Proverbs 22:6 says, &#8220;Train up a child in the way he should go; and when he is old, he will not depart from it.&#8221; And should we allow OTHERS to train up OUR children in the way THEY think they should go? I pray that when I stand before the Lord on judgment day that I would not be so ashamed to say that I allowed someone ELSE to raise up my child. It is our duty.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul</title>
		<link>http://www.dennyburk.com/reckless-court-outlaws-homeschooling/comment-page-1/#comment-33157</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Mar 2008 17:50:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dennyburk.com/?p=1481#comment-33157</guid>
		<description>Well, I&#039;m late in the conversation here, but I do have a few thoughts...

1) The civil libertarian in me thinks that anyone trying to ban homeschooling is a ninny that is yet again trying to put government&#039;s nose where it doesn&#039;t belong.

1a) The civil libertarian in me also thinks that the very same proponents of home schooling have been asking for this for a long time.  You can&#039;t go around trying to limit others&#039; rights while trying to save your own.  Liberty is funny like that.

2) my only fears with home schooling have to do with how well equipped these kids will be when it comes to the idea of a fully well rounded education.  I&#039;ll even set aside the lack of arts education that will likely come when people who only have a narrow view of the culture try to teach it.  But what about science?  How do you expect your child to excel at a secular college without knowledge of the theory of evolution?  What do you do about a reading curriculum?  Is the average &quot;keep ourselves separate from &quot;the world&quot; mom going to have their kids read Thoreau,  Kerouac, Steinbeck or Hemmingway?

Give me a kid who comes out of a home schooling program who can tell me all about the cultural importance of the Beat movement, the musical advancements ushered in by Miles Davis and a thorough evaluation of the theory of evolution, and I&#039;d be much more pro-homeschooling.

Also, how are children judged about when they&#039;re ready to move on to the next grade level?  (this is a serious question, I really have no idea how this works...)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, I&#8217;m late in the conversation here, but I do have a few thoughts&#8230;</p>
<p>1) The civil libertarian in me thinks that anyone trying to ban homeschooling is a ninny that is yet again trying to put government&#8217;s nose where it doesn&#8217;t belong.</p>
<p>1a) The civil libertarian in me also thinks that the very same proponents of home schooling have been asking for this for a long time.  You can&#8217;t go around trying to limit others&#8217; rights while trying to save your own.  Liberty is funny like that.</p>
<p>2) my only fears with home schooling have to do with how well equipped these kids will be when it comes to the idea of a fully well rounded education.  I&#8217;ll even set aside the lack of arts education that will likely come when people who only have a narrow view of the culture try to teach it.  But what about science?  How do you expect your child to excel at a secular college without knowledge of the theory of evolution?  What do you do about a reading curriculum?  Is the average &#8220;keep ourselves separate from &#8220;the world&#8221; mom going to have their kids read Thoreau,  Kerouac, Steinbeck or Hemmingway?</p>
<p>Give me a kid who comes out of a home schooling program who can tell me all about the cultural importance of the Beat movement, the musical advancements ushered in by Miles Davis and a thorough evaluation of the theory of evolution, and I&#8217;d be much more pro-homeschooling.</p>
<p>Also, how are children judged about when they&#8217;re ready to move on to the next grade level?  (this is a serious question, I really have no idea how this works&#8230;)</p>
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		<title>By: Todd Pruitt</title>
		<link>http://www.dennyburk.com/reckless-court-outlaws-homeschooling/comment-page-1/#comment-33155</link>
		<dc:creator>Todd Pruitt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Mar 2008 17:31:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dennyburk.com/?p=1481#comment-33155</guid>
		<description>Lucas,

This is the problem with blog responses and emails - they don&#039;t register sarcasm.

Clearly, Jeremy&#039;s comments were childish and ignorant.  Further, his explanation that he was just getting us to think descends into the nether regions of self-delusion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lucas,</p>
<p>This is the problem with blog responses and emails &#8211; they don&#8217;t register sarcasm.</p>
<p>Clearly, Jeremy&#8217;s comments were childish and ignorant.  Further, his explanation that he was just getting us to think descends into the nether regions of self-delusion.</p>
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		<title>By: Matt</title>
		<link>http://www.dennyburk.com/reckless-court-outlaws-homeschooling/comment-page-1/#comment-33153</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Mar 2008 17:13:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dennyburk.com/?p=1481#comment-33153</guid>
		<description>@JZ
The &quot;qualification&quot; argument is rediculous. &quot;Unqualified&quot; home schoolers consistently produce students that outperform students educated by &quot;certified&quot; teachers on all manner of standardized tests. Here&#039;s and idea fom Doug Wilson: 

Let me first grant the initial point, which is that some homeschoolers don&#039;t do an adequate job. How is that an argument for bringing in &quot;quality control&quot; from the king of all educational inadequate jobs -- the state? And having granted the initial point, let me propose a little contest -- let us compare SAT scores of all homeschooled California seniors and government school California seniors. Whoever loses has to be regulated by the other entity. If the homeschoolers lose, then the new law stands. If the government school loses, then we turn over the California Department of Education to a select committee of homeschooling moms. Ask them to fix it, or throw it away if it is beyond repair.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@JZ<br />
The &#8220;qualification&#8221; argument is rediculous. &#8220;Unqualified&#8221; home schoolers consistently produce students that outperform students educated by &#8220;certified&#8221; teachers on all manner of standardized tests. Here&#8217;s and idea fom Doug Wilson: </p>
<p>Let me first grant the initial point, which is that some homeschoolers don&#8217;t do an adequate job. How is that an argument for bringing in &#8220;quality control&#8221; from the king of all educational inadequate jobs &#8212; the state? And having granted the initial point, let me propose a little contest &#8212; let us compare SAT scores of all homeschooled California seniors and government school California seniors. Whoever loses has to be regulated by the other entity. If the homeschoolers lose, then the new law stands. If the government school loses, then we turn over the California Department of Education to a select committee of homeschooling moms. Ask them to fix it, or throw it away if it is beyond repair.</p>
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		<title>By: Lucas Knisely</title>
		<link>http://www.dennyburk.com/reckless-court-outlaws-homeschooling/comment-page-1/#comment-33150</link>
		<dc:creator>Lucas Knisely</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Mar 2008 16:14:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dennyburk.com/?p=1481#comment-33150</guid>
		<description>Todd,

I&#039;m pretty sure, in light of the content of the article that Denny linked to, people would&#039;ve thought just as deeply about the topic and responded in kind.

At best, Jerem Z&#039;s input brought about reactions, not deep thought.  Reactions do not necessarily mean that all the home schooling parents just suddenly thought about the topic for the very first time in a deep and meaningful way.  In fact, I&#039;d be willing to bet that everyone who responded to Jerem Z, myself included, already thought highly of home schooling and were aptly able to defend it.

Honestly, if it took Jerem Z&#039;s silly comments to foster deep thought, then shame on any parents who were mindlessly home schooling their kids up until the point they read Jerem Z&#039;s &quot;insightful observations&quot; and only then started to think deeply about it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Todd,</p>
<p>I&#8217;m pretty sure, in light of the content of the article that Denny linked to, people would&#8217;ve thought just as deeply about the topic and responded in kind.</p>
<p>At best, Jerem Z&#8217;s input brought about reactions, not deep thought.  Reactions do not necessarily mean that all the home schooling parents just suddenly thought about the topic for the very first time in a deep and meaningful way.  In fact, I&#8217;d be willing to bet that everyone who responded to Jerem Z, myself included, already thought highly of home schooling and were aptly able to defend it.</p>
<p>Honestly, if it took Jerem Z&#8217;s silly comments to foster deep thought, then shame on any parents who were mindlessly home schooling their kids up until the point they read Jerem Z&#8217;s &#8220;insightful observations&#8221; and only then started to think deeply about it.</p>
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		<title>By: Todd Pruitt</title>
		<link>http://www.dennyburk.com/reckless-court-outlaws-homeschooling/comment-page-1/#comment-32830</link>
		<dc:creator>Todd Pruitt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Mar 2008 00:24:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dennyburk.com/?p=1481#comment-32830</guid>
		<description>Dr. Putnam,

Don&#039;t you see?  Jeremy is just getting us to think.  Without his insiteful obserations we may never have thought deeply about how we choose to educate our children.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dr. Putnam,</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t you see?  Jeremy is just getting us to think.  Without his insiteful obserations we may never have thought deeply about how we choose to educate our children.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert  Putnam</title>
		<link>http://www.dennyburk.com/reckless-court-outlaws-homeschooling/comment-page-1/#comment-32783</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert  Putnam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Mar 2008 17:35:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dennyburk.com/?p=1481#comment-32783</guid>
		<description>Yes, Jeremy, your statements have proven to be contentious, divisive, and slanderous. Please find another blog site if you wish to engage in childish rhetoric.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, Jeremy, your statements have proven to be contentious, divisive, and slanderous. Please find another blog site if you wish to engage in childish rhetoric.</p>
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		<title>By: David Drake</title>
		<link>http://www.dennyburk.com/reckless-court-outlaws-homeschooling/comment-page-1/#comment-32782</link>
		<dc:creator>David Drake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Mar 2008 17:24:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dennyburk.com/?p=1481#comment-32782</guid>
		<description>What idiot would ever want another option for their children?...

I would.  I  always find it interesting how Christians have largely abandoned the public schools and then complain about how bad it is...Interesting. 

I also find it interesting that home-schoolers argue for the importance of &quot;Home&quot;, but then deny that that same home might have an effect on them and enable their success in a public school. 

Now I don&#039;t really care either way what you choose to do with your children.  I do care if you spiritualize it,  Make wild claims about how amazing your kids are, Or make equally bad assumptions about how terrible mine must be.(I was a youth pastor for years...with public school kids and home schooled kids...now I am a pastor and have a bunch of home schooled adults in our congregation...and let me tell you: they can go either way...)  

Here is the deal...you may choose, I think, within the guidelines of scripture, to send your children to a public school or to keep them home.  I would not want to infringe at all on that decision.  However I would appeal to you to remember that the issue is not settled and not black and white.

We live in an Urban neighborhood reaching urban people...our daughter goes to the local school.  She is in the top of her class (side note: our urban school with an over 60% poverty rate is in the top schools in the state of Michigan,  and most first graders leave the first grade reading at a 3rd grade level)...Here is the thing I believe my daughter does well because we are involved.  Here is the other thing: We made a conscious ministry decision to send her to the public school. We are church planters, in a neighborhood with all kinds of people who have never even heard of Jesus.  We actually meet for church in the school.  If we did not send our daughter there we would be cut off in many ways form sharing Jesus.   This was our decision and call.  You might not like it, but it is our call.  Please don&#039;t assume that you are the only ones who are doing right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What idiot would ever want another option for their children?&#8230;</p>
<p>I would.  I  always find it interesting how Christians have largely abandoned the public schools and then complain about how bad it is&#8230;Interesting. </p>
<p>I also find it interesting that home-schoolers argue for the importance of &#8220;Home&#8221;, but then deny that that same home might have an effect on them and enable their success in a public school. </p>
<p>Now I don&#8217;t really care either way what you choose to do with your children.  I do care if you spiritualize it,  Make wild claims about how amazing your kids are, Or make equally bad assumptions about how terrible mine must be.(I was a youth pastor for years&#8230;with public school kids and home schooled kids&#8230;now I am a pastor and have a bunch of home schooled adults in our congregation&#8230;and let me tell you: they can go either way&#8230;)  </p>
<p>Here is the deal&#8230;you may choose, I think, within the guidelines of scripture, to send your children to a public school or to keep them home.  I would not want to infringe at all on that decision.  However I would appeal to you to remember that the issue is not settled and not black and white.</p>
<p>We live in an Urban neighborhood reaching urban people&#8230;our daughter goes to the local school.  She is in the top of her class (side note: our urban school with an over 60% poverty rate is in the top schools in the state of Michigan,  and most first graders leave the first grade reading at a 3rd grade level)&#8230;Here is the thing I believe my daughter does well because we are involved.  Here is the other thing: We made a conscious ministry decision to send her to the public school. We are church planters, in a neighborhood with all kinds of people who have never even heard of Jesus.  We actually meet for church in the school.  If we did not send our daughter there we would be cut off in many ways form sharing Jesus.   This was our decision and call.  You might not like it, but it is our call.  Please don&#8217;t assume that you are the only ones who are doing right.</p>
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		<title>By: Todd Pruitt</title>
		<link>http://www.dennyburk.com/reckless-court-outlaws-homeschooling/comment-page-1/#comment-32766</link>
		<dc:creator>Todd Pruitt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Mar 2008 15:24:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dennyburk.com/?p=1481#comment-32766</guid>
		<description>Jeremy,

Thanks so much for helping us think.  Your wise and thoughtful comments are so helpful to us stupid white male rednecks.  Do you ever feel as guilty as I do about having been born white?  

Clearly the public school system in America has served you well.  It is a shining beacon to the rest of the world.  What idiot would ever want another option for their children?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeremy,</p>
<p>Thanks so much for helping us think.  Your wise and thoughtful comments are so helpful to us stupid white male rednecks.  Do you ever feel as guilty as I do about having been born white?  </p>
<p>Clearly the public school system in America has served you well.  It is a shining beacon to the rest of the world.  What idiot would ever want another option for their children?</p>
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		<title>By: Monday Meanderings, 03/10/09 &#171; Ponder Anew</title>
		<link>http://www.dennyburk.com/reckless-court-outlaws-homeschooling/comment-page-1/#comment-32759</link>
		<dc:creator>Monday Meanderings, 03/10/09 &#171; Ponder Anew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Mar 2008 13:43:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dennyburk.com/?p=1481#comment-32759</guid>
		<description>[...] unless they have a teaching certificate issued by the state. (Denny Burk has a nice set of links here.)  This frontal attack on parent&#8217;s rights essentially outlaws 99% of the homeschoolers in [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] unless they have a teaching certificate issued by the state. (Denny Burk has a nice set of links here.)  This frontal attack on parent&#8217;s rights essentially outlaws 99% of the homeschoolers in [...]</p>
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